THE St. Louis Speakeasy
It is currently Mon Oct 23, 2017 4:44 am GMT

All times are UTC - 8 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 53 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4
Author Message

The Personification of Spring
 Post subject: Re: Sherlock (BBC)- potential for spoilers
PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2014 5:00 pm GMT 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Mar 28, 2011 3:06 pm GMT
Posts: 5164
Location: Jurassic Park (Florida)
Custom Title: The Personification of Spring
I'm afraid I don't follow. (And I looked it up-what's a hearse got to do with it? So far as I can figure that's just an episode title.)

_________________
Here be characters! (More on the way...)
Upson Cage
Lawrence Reynolds
Michael Cezley
Jack Brown
Nick White


Top
 Profile  
 

Non-Furry Control Group
 Post subject: Re: Sherlock (BBC)- potential for spoilers
PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2014 7:58 pm GMT 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jun 26, 2007 4:04 pm GMT
Posts: 11001
Location: England
Custom Title: Non-Furry Control Group
JacobGrey wrote:
I squeed for ten minutes straight after "Did you miss me?"

Actually I'm still squeeing



Overall I enjoyed the episode, but I must say, the whole 'Did you miss me' thing felt more like Doctor Who than Sherlock (and not in a good way).

_________________
Image

"I do not give one on a boat, I do not give one in an oak. I do not give one here or there; I do not give one anywhere. I do not give a fuck you see; now go away, and leave me be".


Top
 Profile  
 

European! Old! Pretentious!
 Post subject: Re: Sherlock (BBC)- potential for spoilers
PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2014 9:34 pm GMT 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Nov 28, 2008 5:52 am GMT
Posts: 8923
Location: Probably not in your timezone (Scotland)
Custom Title: European! Old! Pretentious!
I basically just meant 'watch the episode' 'The empty hearse', but I don't think you'll get much out of it, not having been with the series the whole time.

Regarding 'His Last Vow'.. SPOILERS OBVIOUSLY

This episode went nothing like I had feared, and I am glad of that! Kudos to those on the show for dropping ACCURATE hints to the fandom that led their suspicions in a different direction from what was actually going to happen. Benedict Cumberbatch stated that you would understand why the previous episodes were comedic, once you saw the third, hinting there’d be a need for comedy to balance out the darkness. I saw posts between Sue Vertue (TV producer who is Moffat’s wife) and Amanda Abington (who plays Mary) along the lines of ‘sometimes, someone has to die’.

All these hints had people, including me, thinking and fearing that Mary and/or the kid would die. After all, Mary dies at some point early on in canon.

All those hints were.. accurate while totally misleading, and I love that. I DID come out of this third episode understanding more why they’d spent a whole episode on a wedding (because MARY and her relationship to John needed to be established as really important for it to emotionally matter to the audience). And as for ‘sometimes someone has to die’ that is obviously a theme throughout.

There were lots of reference to original Conan Doyle stories in this episode, which I enjoyed- from the modern day 'opium den' to the general blackmail plot throughout, to the theme developed with Mary regarding secrets between a husband and wife, which is present in a lot of Conan Doyle stories. The one part with canon precedent I certainly didn't enjoy was Sherlock's horrible duping of Janine just to get inside of Magnusson's building. So cruel- and I find it a bit OOC THIS Sherlock could convincingly fake being such an incredibly NORMAL boyfriend.

Anyhow, it was clever that we're set up to think it's Lady Smallwood who's taking her revenge, but it turns out to be Mary who plays the avenging role central to the Conan Doyle story 'The adventure of Charles Augustus Milverton' upon which this episode is based.

When Mary turned out not to be what we thought, I was scared for a moment that she was just going to be killed off and swiftly removed from the series, but instead we saw a more complex treatment of her character- as I said with precedence in Doyle stories.

I’ve seen some criticise John for being quick to forgive her, and baffled at Sherlock being okay with her- but I think that Sherlock is okay with her because he seems to actually.. identify with her- as someone who isn’t ordinary but who cares deeply for John and will in fact ‘do anything’ for him. Sherlock understands Mary shooting him because it’s the kind of thing he can imagine doing himself to protect John (mirrored in his later shooting of Magnusson). The parallels between Mary and Sherlock also make sense in explaining part of why Watson forgives, given time (several months pass without him talking to her before they meet again at Christmas). It’s in his character to forgive quite a lot- he’s forgiven a lot from Sherlock already. Plus, there is the kid to consider.

That said, it’s not very fair though, that victim blaming tone they get of ‘well, it’s your choice, you keep falling into company with people who are into danger, and who are psychopaths’! John has every reason to be deeply hurt and deeply distrustful, and I would not forgive so easily in his place.

I think it’s nice though that we get here what we don’t often get- a woman who messes up in a MAJOR way, who turns out to be something completely unlike what she was thought to be, to the point of shooting the hero, and yet still gets treated as redeemable by the narrative- as worthy of forgiveness and capable of forging a new life away from her past.

Other good things in this episode- some treatment of Sherlock's drug issues, Sherlock and Mycroft at the family home, the psychological insight given into Sherlock's mind palace, the well set up if completely disgusting villain.

Other not so good things in this episode in my opinion, other than that horrible thing Sherlock did to Janine- people seem a bit.. ready to be violent in this episode- like Sherlock hurting Mycroft and Molly slapping Sherlock in the face. Maybe it's just me, but I would never actually raise a hand to or generally hurt someone that I cared about in a physical way.. it crosses a line I wouldn't and yet is treated fairly lightly. Also the 'exotic dancer' and 'porn preference' things seemed a bit.. cheap.

Sherlock shooting Magnusson I am in two minds about. I was really hoping somebody would do it, because bloody hell, he was such an incredibly repugnant villain I wanted him to get violently killed more with every scene. I was as such, highly satisfied that Sherlock shot him. However, it has to be said that Sherlock Holmes (generally) tends not to be the kind to solve problems in this way, I don’t think Holmes has done anything like this in the original stories (I think?), and it would have also been nice if it had been a more cerebral solution- Sherlock was not as smart as usual in this episode. Still, I understand though, that the overall point of this whole episode is that Sherlock has done something reckless and violent in order to fulfil his ‘last vow’- to protect Mary and John and the kid. It’s not widely out of character, and parallels Mary’s willingness to do the same to Magnusson.

Re the ending 'did you miss me?' I personally think they should’ve made clear whether he was back or not- because supposing he isn’t, they’ll annoy a lot of people by teasing them with it, and supposing he is- there wouldn't have been anything lost by making that absolutely clear. I’m also not 100% sure if I want him to be back- the Reichenbach fall was such an emotionally satisfying end to Sherlock’s problem with him and destroying his network was the whole point of Sherlock’s two year absence- how are they going to do that again, supposing he actually IS back? It seems to cheapen all the significant stuff that went on because of that. On the other hand, shooting himself in the head always seemed a bit too drastic..

_________________
My RP charactersEnter the monthly Lackadaisy writing contest! How to RP- A guide for newbies


Top
 Profile  
 

Literary Revolutionary
 Post subject: Re: Sherlock (BBC)- potential for spoilers
PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 5:21 am GMT 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Apr 21, 2007 1:52 pm GMT
Posts: 17760
Location: Sipping tea with Oscar Wilde, in my basement
Custom Title: Literary Revolutionary
I always thought that it would be a bit strange to have Sherlock fake his death so convincingly and not for there to be a trick on Moriarty's part. Even if the trick was, he really is dead but he has someone else behind the scenes who will take over for him.

Also, that WAS musical and amusing, you are correct :P

_________________
Boredom bred the thoughts of throwing bricks~
Character List ; Food Blog ; Writing on Patreon
Image


Top
 Profile  
 

European! Old! Pretentious!
 Post subject: Re: Sherlock (BBC)- potential for spoilers
PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 9:53 am GMT 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Nov 28, 2008 5:52 am GMT
Posts: 8923
Location: Probably not in your timezone (Scotland)
Custom Title: European! Old! Pretentious!
It does strike me that they actually never explained what happened with him- that is, in their recap of the story surrounding 'Richard Brook' they actually didn't mention that he was dead or mention what happened with his body.

HOWEVER given that Sherlock did spend like 2 years dismantling his network, you have to wonder how it is he could've missed that. Anyhow, we'll see what they do. I'm not speculating this time about what was done or what it means or trying to determine if he really is going to be back, I am just going to wait the long, sad wait and see.

_________________
My RP charactersEnter the monthly Lackadaisy writing contest! How to RP- A guide for newbies


Top
 Profile  
 

The Personification of Spring
 Post subject: Re: Sherlock (BBC)- potential for spoilers
PostPosted: Mon Jan 20, 2014 4:34 pm GMT 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Mar 28, 2011 3:06 pm GMT
Posts: 5164
Location: Jurassic Park (Florida)
Custom Title: The Personification of Spring
I happened to be in the room and caught a brief bit of how he cheated death...

What?

_________________
Here be characters! (More on the way...)
Upson Cage
Lawrence Reynolds
Michael Cezley
Jack Brown
Nick White


Top
 Profile  
 

Literary Revolutionary
 Post subject: Re: Sherlock (BBC)- potential for spoilers
PostPosted: Mon Jan 20, 2014 5:00 pm GMT 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Apr 21, 2007 1:52 pm GMT
Posts: 17760
Location: Sipping tea with Oscar Wilde, in my basement
Custom Title: Literary Revolutionary
Seriously? Just stop trolling and go talk about something else.

_________________
Boredom bred the thoughts of throwing bricks~
Character List ; Food Blog ; Writing on Patreon
Image


Top
 Profile  
 

The Personification of Spring
 Post subject: Re: Sherlock (BBC)- potential for spoilers
PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2014 3:39 pm GMT 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Mar 28, 2011 3:06 pm GMT
Posts: 5164
Location: Jurassic Park (Florida)
Custom Title: The Personification of Spring
(Sorry for all that-hadn't realized until now how abrasive and caustic that all sounded. Sorry for the interruption, and carry on.)

_________________
Here be characters! (More on the way...)
Upson Cage
Lawrence Reynolds
Michael Cezley
Jack Brown
Nick White


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 53 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4

All times are UTC - 8 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group